U.S. Death Toll in Iraq Hits 4,000

End this war and bring our troops home!!  4000 dead, 150,000 plus wounded and that is just the American side.  How many total, how many women, children and innocents gone. 

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So what you are saying is that the  "war on terror" has NOT reached  the level of dead from a "police action" YET ?

I am NOT denigrating the dead or their sacrifice. I place high honor upon those who serve in our Military to defend our borders and our rights. Just putting "numbers" in perspective.

 To end  by pull out AGAIN signals to the World that the American people have 1. attention deficient disorder and 2. no capacity for sacrifice. 

 Have you wondered WHY the U.S. has not WON a conflict since World War II ? See above numbers 1 and 2. We have become a people of instant gradification, emotionally charged, individually self centered and a nation of feministic characteristics.

 Our enemies are both willing to sacrifice and unwilling to change their 1400 year determination that we (the Infidels) must DIE.

These words written by a Veteran, U. S. Army Viet Nam

Agreed sparks.  Perspective is everything.  How many died in 5 years in Vietnam?  And then what....we walked away and gave in to the pacifists and lost all those lives for what?  I don't want to see it happen again.  Let's finish the job.  BTW, thank you and welcome home, soldier!

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There are only 52000 more to go to equal the number sacraficed by the Democrats during Viet Nam. And what for, so LBJ and lots of other democrats could get rich. Don't know how many are aware but the old bat Lady Bird was deeply involved with B&R and made lots of money off of the war, then hauled ass and sacraficed 56000 americans for her to get rich.

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Maybe Lady Byrd used the money to buy flowers and seeds for her "beautify American highways" program???     

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Lady Bird did not spend any of her money on anything but her family.

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Blaze, the lady was making the point that the war is costing too much (deaths) so we should quit. I disagree.

In your response I say: In every war there are profiteers (so this argument is a wash even in the argument for/against ANY necessary war). While HISTORY tells us we did not have good arguments to declare war on Hitler, we certainly found moral justification when our men marched into the concentration camps. Those who seek to "Monday morning Quarterback" on the PAST arguments to invade Iraq, do so ONLY because they want to QUIT now. FACT is for whatever reason we are there now and need to finish the job.

(Personally, I never held the belief that we could force DEMOCRACY on a Muslim nation anywhere in the world. They are not western in ideals and goals, no background even in freedom. They have accepted a servitude to ALLAH and wish nothing more. Democracy is unwelcome and foreign to them.)

The point is NOT how we got here or why. The point is : 1) do we exit in a way that ensures the battle is over in Iraq for their people, 2) do we fight terrorists on foreign soil or in American streets ?  and 3) what does it really take for the American people to pull together as a nation ?

1. I have heard nothing from the politicos except "summarily abandon ship" in Iraq. This action is morally reprehensible since it INSURES years of GENOCIDE. But oops, sorry about that guys. The U.S. just hasn't got the gonads for war anymore (if it lasts more than 2 weeks).

2. I'd rather see the "bad boys" (those poor misguided terrorists)  fighting trained troops in the sand box, then see civilian casualties on Main Street U.S.A.

3. From listening alot, I mean ALOT, here and at work, play, church ect...... I think a nuclear blast on Camp Pendleton here in Oceanside, California might merit a week of "pulling together" for most Americans. Yeah, 7 days before the Conspiracy Theories, the "I got to get to work" excuses, before the next episode of Survivor captures the attention of the masses, before the latest song on the radio drowns out the indignant and outraged into a mellow hum. We will slap a patriotic bumpersticker on the old truck and be done with our contribution to "pulling together as a nation". It makes me want to UP CHUCK !!

Sarcasm is REAL thick. Logic is intentional. Observations are MY OWN and do not necessarily reflect those of any other person. So if you disagree, fine.

sparks3, all excellent and well thought out points.  I agree 100%.  I often wonder myself what it will take to make Americans realize that national sacrifices are sometimes necessary.  Even the events of 9/11 have been twisted, distorted, and in most cases seemingly or conveniently forgotten.   How else can the apathy be explained?

It seems like ever since the stoned hippies marched for peace, America lost its guts and willingness to pull together.  Frankly, I grow weary of the old hippies pulling their peacenik stuff again.  It was terrible back then and just as terrible now.

War is not a pretty thing and isn't supposed to be.  However, sometimes it does become necessary and pulling all our troops out now would be such a waste of the lives that were lost and of all the sacrifices so many have made.

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sparks, in response to your 2nd point, I offer one thing for you to think about.  During the 80s, the radical leaders were calling for jihad against the US, including coming over here to attack- it didn't happen.  Why not? Because they understood two things: 1. Attacking Americans on American soil gives the Americans the literal home-field advantage.  They know nothing about our terrain, geography, and people who know both of the above like the back of their hands.  2. It takes time, resources, willing people, and a LOT of money to wage any kind of war, especially one that requires crossing the ocean.  Thus it isn't cost-effective to launch that kind of campaign unless it was the only available option.

Sadly, while the terrorists never made those two mistakes, we did.  What happened to the Taliban? They waited out the bombings in their mountains and regrouped for a counterattack.  Why are our soldiers being attacked so often? Because all they had to do was wait for us to walk in on them.

The idea of "fighting them over there so we don't have to over here" is simply fear-mongering at its worst.  Even if they did pose a credible threat, a thoroughly-prepared war of defense is much easier to wage than a war of offense.

PS: If you wish to offer a rebuttal, do so without using 9/11 as a crutch.  The "official" conspiracy theory (yes, it is still a conspiracy theory) is full of more holes than Swiss cheese and yet so many people who know that the government lies to us 100% of the time believe them this time.  Why? Because they told us not to listen to any other ideas. 

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As Rome burned. Nero blamed the Christians. Amazingly his proclaimation did NOT stop the flames.

You apparently do not believe the "in your face" retoric of the Koran. While I believe that retoric is serious intent.  Fear-mongering ? Believe, when your enemy tells you  he wants to KILL YOU and he can LIE about his intentions and be sinless before ALLAH.

But hay, I said "So if you DISAGREE, fine." Future events will disclose whether you or I am right. The evil of the day is sufficient thereof.

PBS has put together an interesting documentary on the war. Part one was shown last night at 20:00 CST with part two tonight.

Both parts can be seen in their entirity at http://tinyurl.com/3374m8

Had the military been allowed to break things and kill people like they are trained to do, there probably would have been less than fifty casualites. Thank you congress for the rules of engagement that got 4K americans killed.

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To the first poster mkoohio, you are a Liberal. This number is one that the Liberal media celebrates with no respect to the troops who sacrifice themselves to keep our country free from Islam. This number is something that 4,000 soldiers bravely gave their lives. They will not have been in vain as long as we don't give in to people like Pelosi, Cindy Sheehan, Amy Goodman, Ted Kennedy and the rest of the yahoos who want to give in to Al Qaeda with useless diplomacy.

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