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Republican Candidates On Abortion -- May 3, 2007 Debate
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On May 3, 2007, the Republican presidential candidates gathered at the Reagan Library for a television debate (discussion) aired on MSNBC. Here is the candidates' responses to questions related to abortion and life issues, from NYTimes' transcript. For the full transcript, go here(Jump links to these questions) Should Roe v. Wade be repealed? We now go to the next segment. We’re going to talk about values. Let’s go down the line on this, just like they did with the Democrats last week on some of these trickier calls, but they do have clear answers. Starting with you, Governor. Would the day that Roe v. Wade is repealed be a good day for Americans? MR. ROMNEY: Absolutely. MR. MATTHEWS: Senator. SEN. BROWNBACK: Be a glorious day of human liberty and freedom. MR. MATTHEWS: Governor. MR. GILMORE: Yes, it was wrongly decided. MR. MATTHEWS: Governor. MR. HUCKABEE: Most certainly. (Cross talk.) MR. MATTHEWS: Congressman. REP. HUNTER: Yes. MR. MATTHEWS: Governor. MR. THOMPSON: Yes. MR. MATTHEWS: Senator. SEN. MCCAIN: Repeal. MR. MATTHEWS: Mayor. MR. GIULIANI: It would be okay. MR. MATTHEWS: Okay to repeal? MR. GIULIANI: It would be okay to repeal. Or it would be okay also if a strict constructionist judge viewed it as precedent, and I think a judge has to make that decision. MR. MATTHEWS: Would it be okay if they didn’t repeal it? MR. GIULIANI: I think that -- I think the court has to make that decision, and then the country can deal with it. We’re a federalist system of government, and states could make their own decisions. MR. MATTHEWS: Congressman? REP. TANCREDO: After 40 million dead because we have aborted them in this country, I say that that would be the greatest day in this country’s history when that is in fact overturned. MR. MATTHEWS: We’re looking for nuance here. Governor Gilmore, you have said in the past that you believe in the first eight to 12 weeks of pregnancy, that a woman should have the right to have an abortion. Do you still stick with that exception? MR. GILMORE: I do, Chris. My views on this, my beliefs on this are a matter of conviction. And they’ve always been the same, and they’ve never changed the entire time that I’ve been in public life. However, my record as governor of Virginia, I think, has been one that the pro-life community, of which I am a part, would be very proud -- passing a 24-hour waiting period, passing informed consent, passing parental notification, signing the partial-birth abortion law in Virginia. So I think the record is there. But my views -- my views are strongly and fundamentally believed, and been held that way. MR. MATTHEWS: Governor Thompson, do you have any nuance on this, or you’re just happy with the repeal of Roe. v. Wade? MR. THOMPSON: I believe it should be left up to the states. That was what was originally implied in the Constitution and was changed when the Supreme Court made the decision. I, like a lot of people up here, have made a record of pro-life for a long time, signing the partial-birth abortion, pre-notification for parents and so on. I think it’s imperative that states have the responsibility for making these laws.
MR. HARRIS: Governor Romney, in recent months you’ve said you were, quote, "always for life," but we’ve also heard you say you were once, quote, "effectively pro-choice." Which is it? MR. ROMNEY: Well, I’ve always been personally pro-life, but for me there was a great question about whether or not government should intrude in that decision. And when I ran for office, I said I’d protect the law as it was, which is effectively a pro-choice position. About two years ago when we were studying cloning in our state, I said, look, we have gone too far; it’s a brave new world mentality that Roe v. Wade has given us; and I change my mind. I took the same course that Ronald Reagan and George Herbert Walker Bush and Henry Hyde took. And I said I was wrong and changed my mind and said I’m pro-life. And I’m proud of that and I won’t apologize to anybody for becoming pro-life. MR. HARRIS: Governor, with respect, some people are going to see those changes of mind as awfully politically convenient. MR. ROMNEY: You know, I told you that I studied at great length this issue. When I ran, I -- for the very first time, I told you that I was personally pro-life but that I would protect a woman’s right to choose as the law existed. And that stayed the same until until two years ago, as I indicated, and at that time, as a result of the debate we had, the conclusion I reached was that we had gone too far, that cloning and that creating new embryos was wrong, and that we should therefore allow our state to become a pro-life state. I believe states should have the right to make this decision, and that’s a position I indicated in an op-ed to the Boston Globe two years ago. Brownback: Could you support a pro-abortion Republican nominee? MR. HARRIS: Senator Brownback, this is an important issue for you. SEN. BROWNBACK: It is. MR. HARRIS: Could you support a nominee of your party who is not pro-life? SEN. BROWNBACK: I could because I believe in the Ronald Reagan principle that somebody that’s with you 80 percent of the time is not your enemy; that’s your friend and that’s our ally. And this is a big coalition party, and it’s a coalition party that’s governed for a number of years in this country. And it governs because it governs with a coalition of economic and social conservatives and people that want to be strong for the United States. But I want to emphasize, I believe life is one of the central issues of our day, and I believe that every human life at every phase is unique, is beautiful, is a child of a loving God period. MR. MATTHEWS: Let me get back to Governor -- Mayor Giuliani because I want to give you a chance on this. You became very well known for standing up against the use of public funds for what many people considered indecent exhibits at the Brooklyn Museum and places like that. Giuliani: Public funding for abortions? Why do you support the use of public funds for abortion? MR. GIULIANI: I don’t. I support the Hyde amendment. I hate abortion. I wish people didn’t have abortions. MR. MATTHEWS: So you’re not for funding at all? MR. GIULIANI: I believe that the Hyde amendment should remain the law. States should make their decision. Some states decide to do it, most states decide not to do it. And I think that’s the appropriate way to have this decided. MR. MATTHEWS: Should New York -- when you were mayor of New York, should they have been paying for -- the state should have been paying for -- MR. GIULIANI: That’s a decision New York made a long time ago, and New York -- MR. MATTHEWS: And where were you on that? MR. GIULIANI: I supported it in New York. But I think in other places, people can come to a different decision. Romney: Catholics denying communion to pro-abortion politicians? MR. MATTHEWS: Governor Romney, what do you say to Roman Catholic bishops who would deny communion to elected officials who support abortion rights? MR. ROMNEY: I don’t say anything to Roman Catholic bishops. They can do whatever the heck they want. (Laughter.) Roman Catholic bishops are in a private institution, a religion, and they can do whatever they want in a religion. America -- MR. MATTHEWS: Do you see that as interference in public life? MR. ROMNEY: Well, I can’t imagine a government telling a church who can have communion in their church. I can’t -- we have a separation of church and state; it’s served us well in this country. Romney and Giuliani respond to each other MR. VANDEHEI: Governor Romney, you said that being a pro-life president entails more than just appointing strict constructionist judges. A Politico.com reader wants to know what you meant by that, and whether that was directed specifically at Mayor Giuliani. MR. ROMNEY: It’s directed at anybody who’s not pro-life. And I have had the opportunity of serving as a governor and finding that while the courts were making decisions that affected abortion, it’s really upon the legislature and the governor to have an impact as well. And so you can fight, for instance, to make sure that partial- birth abortion is made illegal. You can fight to have information given to women who are thinking about having an abortion. You can fight to make sure that there’s opportunities for people to express their views on this topic openly and near abortion clinics. You can fight for the opportunity to go out and campaign for the rights of those that care about this issue to be heard before Election Day, and the McCain-Feingold law prevents that from happening. MR. MATTHEWS: That’s time, Governor. Let me ask Mayor Giuliani, do you want to respond to this? Because it seems like across the room here there’s strong, unrelenting -- with the exception of Governor Gilmore -- an unrelenting pro-life position. You seem to have a nuanced position on this. Many people think you’re pro-choice. Could you define it in a couple of seconds? MR. GIULIANI: Sure. This is a very, very difficult issue of conscience for many, many people. In my case, I hate abortion. I would encourage someone to not take that option. When I was mayor of New York city, I encouraged adoptions; adoptions went up 65-70 percent, abortions went down 16 percent. But ultimately, since it is an issue of conscience, I would respect a woman’s right to make a different choice. I support the ban on partial-birth abortion, I support the Hyde amendment, but ultimately I think when you come down to that choice, you have to respect a woman’s right to make that choice differently than my conscience. Tancredo on a women's "right" to abortion MR. VANDEHEI: Congressman Tancredo, this reader requests a yes or no answer. Will you work to protect women’s rights, as in fair wages and reproductive choice? REP. TANCREDO: I will work to product -- to protect women’s rights. The reproductive choice part of that, if I heard you correctly, is a reference to abortion. The right to kill another person is not a right that I would agree with and support. All candidates on embryonic stem cell research MR. MATTHEWS: We have to go down the line again. It’s always fun to ask these questions down the line. (Laughter.) We have Mrs. Reagan here. The camera will not focus on her, but I will tell you, it will now focus on you. Mrs. Reagan wants to expand federal funding of embryonic stem cell research. Will that progress under your administration? Governor. MR. ROMNEY: It certainly will. Altered Nuclear Transfer, I think, is perhaps the best course. MR. MATTHEWS: Embryonic. Embryonic. MR. ROMNEY: Altered Nuclear Transfer creates embryo-like cells that can be used for stem cell research. In my view, that’s the most promising source. I have a deep concern about curing disease. I have a wife that has a serious disease that could be affected by stem cell research and others, but I will not create new ebryos through cloning or through embryo farming because that would be creating life for the purpose of destroying it. MR. MATTHEWS: And you won’t take any from these fertility clinics to use either. MR. ROMNEY: I’m happy to allow that -- or I shouldn’t say happy. It’s fine for that to be allowed to be legal. I won’t use our government funds for that. Instead, I want our government funds to be used on Dr.Hurlbut’s method, which is Altered Nuclear Transfer. MR. MATTHEWS: The same question. Embryonic stem cell research with federal funds, sir. SEN. BROWNBACK: It will not -- with all due respect to Mrs. Reagan and her desires here, I’ve studied this matter a great deal. We are curing and healing people with adult stem cells. It is not necessary to kill a human life for us to heal people, and we’re doing it with adult stem cell work and it’s getting done. MR. MATTHEWS: Okay. I’m going to have to go yes or no. Governor Gilmore, for embryonic stem cell federal funding or not? MR. GILMORE: We can’t create people in order to experiment with people. MR. MATTHEWS: Okay. Governor Huckabee. MR. HUCKABEE: I would concur. I don’t think it’s right to create a life to end a life. That’s not a good health decision. MR. MATTHEWS: Congressman? REP. HUNTER: No. I’d like to show Mrs. Reagan the alternatives, which are adult stem cells. MR. MATTHEWS: Okay. Governor Thompson. MR. THOMPSON: There’s so much research going on, Chris, you cannot answer that question yes or no. There’s research currently going on right now at the Waisman Center in Madison, Wisconsin, that’s going to allow for adult stem cells -- MR. MATTHEWS: Right. MR. THOMPSON: -- to become pluripotent, which will have the same characteristics of embryonic stem cells. So you do not have to kill an embryo. MR. MATTHEWS: Senator, embryonic stem cell, federal funding. SEN. MCCAIN: I want to thank Mrs. Reagan for the many kindnesses extended to me many -- and my fellow prisoners of war many years ago when we came home to this wonderful state. I believe that we need to fund this. This is a tough issue for those of us in the pro-life community. I would remind you that these stem cells are either going to be discarded or perpetually frozen. We need to do what we can to relieve human suffering. It’s a tough issue. I support federal funding. MR. MATTHEWS: That’s a yes. Dr. Paul, yes or no on federal funding. REP. PAUL: Programs like this are not authorized under the Constitution. The trouble with this -- issues like this is in Washington we either prohibit it or subsidize it. MR. MATTHEWS: Right. REP. PAUL: And the market should deal with it and the states should deal with it. MR. MATTHEWS: Okay. That’s a no. MR. GIULIANI: As long as we’re not creating life in order to destroy it, as long as we’re not having human cloning, and we limit it to that, and there is plenty of opportunity to then use federal funds in those situations where you have limitations. So I would support it with those limitations, like Senator Coleman’s bill in Congress. MR. MATTHEWS: Mr. Tancredo. REP. TANCREDO: There are billions of dollars going into this research right now. It does not require me taking money from federal -- MR. MATTHEWS: Okay -- REP. TANCREDO: -- from taxpayers in the United States to fund it and -- because it is morally, I think, reprehensible in certain ways.
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